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How does Toothless (rephrase: Night Furies) take off vertically?
Topic Started: 31 Aug 2015, 10:12 (1788 Views)
Toothless123
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Night Fury

Just something I've been wondering. :/
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draco
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mystery dragon, pic drawn by night fury fire. Thank you :)

Hmmm,good question.
Dragons, need I say more.

Hiccup, chief of berc, dragon master.
Toothless, alpha dragon.
You and me bud we can do this, as one.
It's just a zipple misunderstanding
I like a pit, but I love a boar pit.
i am hurt,I am very much hurt.
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VeloYourSwaggyDragon
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I am... swaggy

Anyone here a physics person or knows aero-physics really well?
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sageman
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Terrible Terror

in which way do you mean taking off vertically

anyway hears a few things to read and watch

https://christophereppig.wordpress.com/ ... of-flight/
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LxzyAadoyzY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Upq7LyhCGXE

in short flying dinosaurs although genetically closer to birds flew like bats would have done
simply looking at the amount of joints in the wings bats have more that our hands whereas birds only have a few
flying dinosaurs were very similar in their wing makeup and also wouldn't have had feathers but a membrane

looking at the night fury wing its very clear its based on the bat not the bird so if you want to know about night fury flight look at bat flight and assume the differences are down to evolution
FIGHT WAR NOT WARS
DESTROY POWER NOT PEOPLE
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Demonwolf002
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Lone Dragon

Man I really enjoy it when this topic pops up very interesting one to disscuss and read. Especially when you get someone who knows a lot about aerodynamics and aero-physics especially concerning birds and bats. With that said take anything I say on the topic with a grain of salt considering I'm not well-versed in any of it. :P
sageman
02 Sep 2015, 01:43
in which way do you mean taking off vertically
I would assume Toothless123 means a hover then take off from the ground at a solitary stance.
On another note though here's an article with video of a bat taking off.
http://www.smithsonianmag.com/science-n ... 23/?no-ist
sageman
02 Sep 2015, 01:43
https://christophereppig.wordpress.com/ ... of-flight/
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LxzyAadoyzY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Upq7LyhCGXE

in short flying dinosaurs although genetically closer to birds flew like bats would have done
simply looking at the amount of joints in the wings bats have more that our hands whereas birds only have a few
flying dinosaurs were very similar in their wing makeup and also wouldn't have had feathers but a membrane

looking at the night fury wing its very clear its based on the bat not the bird so if you want to know about night fury flight look at bat flight and assume the differences are down to evolution
Now I find this really interesting especially considering I've had a conversation with Jackthevulture in the past about how Toothless (and Night Furies in general) flight is based at least somewhat off of soaring birds.(Going to post the response in a spoiler for those who may be interested.)
Spoiler: click to toggle
(Keep in mind Jacks response was from some time ago and was concerning Toothless's hovering in the Breakneck Bog episode. As well as the fact Jacks opinions and knowledge may have changed since then.)

Personally looking at what I know about the two animals, Toothless, and flight in general. I would say his flight takes from both to a certain extent(that being soaring birds and bats). I'm sure it can be stated he takes after one more than the other, but that's not for me to decide. Would love to here what you think though. Also I think Jacks response goes really well into actual vertical take off.(That being hovering and taking off from a completely stationary stance.) Which because of body size, wing span, and the amount of possible energy consumption necessary for such a maneuver would make it very unlikely that Toothless or any Night Fury would be able to do so. Would love to hear others opinions on this though.
See you in the skies Dragon Rider!

The Dragon Root:Thing what I wrote.

Is Toothless Evil? :Me possibly being crazy, but fun.

The BerkCast The HTTYD podcast, you should listen.
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Toothless123
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Night Fury

Thanks for all your guys' responses! :) I haven't had a chance to read them all yet, but I just wanted to let you know that I am not ignoring this thread! ^_^
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sageman
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Terrible Terror

only small birds can actually hover due to the large energy requirements
large birds can hover however by facing into the wind there's a fair few large birds that can do this

in question to the large energy needed to take off vertically hookfang is known to weigh 5000lbs which is only 2.2 tonnes for an animal that size isnt much (does anyone know what toothless weighs)
anyway we can assume that all dragons have a very lightweight construction (this however beggs the question on how survivable the veryous falls toothless has made are) anyway as toothless is the fastest flyer we can assume he has the best muscle construction and due to being very light for the size he is not need as much energy to take off as it may look

FIGHT WAR NOT WARS
DESTROY POWER NOT PEOPLE
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hictooth
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Archivist of Berk

You should have a read through of a post on the Night Fury's Den. It's a bit depressing, but it detailed how Toothless would actually have to go over 60km/h in order to fly.

So sadly, it means that scenes such as Romantic Flight where Toothless flies along as a slow gentle speed without flapping his wings are impossible. The animators took several liberties when animating Toothless flying, which also includes him taking off vertically. This would not happen in real life.

However, you have to remember that in HTTYD, there are other non-factual occurrences as well. I mean, there are dragons!?

hictooth
Astrid - "Hictooth"?
Hiccup - Yeah, it's not my snappiest comeback.
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