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Contradicting Messages?
Topic Started: 07 Sep 2014, 11:33 (2339 Views)
RealHousewifeofBerk
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"You don't know this yet, but people need you."
<3

Maybe it was just me, but did it seem like the messages of the two movies clashed? ^)

It seems like the first movie's moral was to not be afraid to stand out, to do something different, follow your heart, forgive and forget, stand up for what you believe in, and that something or someone we may perceive as "bad" or "evil" may just be misunderstood.

The second, however, seems to be telling people that if everyone is telling you not to do something, then you really shouldn't, that you can't always trust your instinct, and that some people aren't worthy of forgiveness, nor capable of change.

I've seen one review of the first movie, (albeit, a negative one >:( ) describe it as a "junior knows best" story, but then the second one was like...wow. Didn't exactly know best.

I know the main message of both movies is friendship, but to me it kind of seems like the other lessons don't match up. Feel free to tell me I'm wrong about something. Maybe the combined message is to trust and forgive, but to know where to stop?
My other fandoms summed up in gifs:



"You have the heart of a Hiro and the soul of a Tadashi."
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Pikey
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Wow!

Yes, but in the long run it proved vital. Stoick may have been killed, but as a result of that Hiccup managed to defeat Drago overall and see his mother again. Not to mention bringing Eret into his crew. Not saying Stoick isn't important at all, but it was important that it happened in order for Hiccup to take over as he was supposed to, and it will probably come back to prove important for the plot of the third movie in some way.

Also, this is HTTYD, not everything goes exactly as Hiccup intends it so it's hard to pinpoint classic morals on it when you have this kind of story. :P
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micromys
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Cathartes Aura

I don't think it's a conflicting message, but a combined message, like you said. It's important to have both experiences.

In the first movie, Hiccup gambled a lot on his optimism and it paid off -- it paid off extremely well, so well that he is unwilling to budge from it when faced with a different situation in the second film. That unwillingness ends up coming back to bite him in the end, when his strategy doesn't work and he ends up losing loved ones.

It's a good thing for him to keep in mind as he becomes Chief. He knows minds can be changed -- and they can! Eret was just another example -- but not all of them, and if you put too much on the line trying to reach out to those who won't listen then you may not be giving proper protection to the people (and dragons!) under your care. (Also, listen to the advice of the people close to you! Both Stoick and Valka had experience with Drago, but Hiccup rolled his eyes and ignored what they had to say about his stubbornness and desire for war.)

Hiccup's learned now to evaluate the situation more carefully and adjust his actions in accordance. I don't think that contradicts the first film, I think that's building from it. They are all lessons which together make him who he is.
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RealHousewifeofBerk
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"You don't know this yet, but people need you."
<3

micromys
07 Sep 2014, 19:57
I don't think it's a conflicting message, but a combined message, like you said. It's important to have both experiences.

In the first movie, Hiccup gambled a lot on his optimism and it paid off -- it paid off extremely well, so well that he is unwilling to budge from it when faced with a different situation in the second film. That unwillingness ends up coming back to bite him in the end, when his strategy doesn't work and he ends up losing loved ones.

It's a good thing for him to keep in mind as he becomes Chief. He knows minds can be changed -- and they can! Eret was just another example -- but not all of them, and if you put too much on the line trying to reach out to those who won't listen then you may not be giving proper protection to the people (and dragons!) under your care. (Also, listen to the advice of the people close to you! Both Stoick and Valka had experience with Drago, but Hiccup rolled his eyes and ignored what they had to say about his stubbornness and desire for war.)

Hiccup's learned now to evaluate the situation more carefully and adjust his actions in accordance. I don't think that contradicts the first film, I think that's building from it. They are all lessons which together make him who he is.
Wow. I really think you hit the nail on the head. Great job! :)

My other fandoms summed up in gifs:



"You have the heart of a Hiro and the soul of a Tadashi."
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Quincy Dan
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The real Hiccup

micromys
07 Sep 2014, 19:57
I don't think it's a conflicting message, but a combined message, like you said. It's important to have both experiences.

In the first movie, Hiccup gambled a lot on his optimism and it paid off -- it paid off extremely well, so well that he is unwilling to budge from it when faced with a different situation in the second film. That unwillingness ends up coming back to bite him in the end, when his strategy doesn't work and he ends up losing loved ones.

It's a good thing for him to keep in mind as he becomes Chief. He knows minds can be changed -- and they can! Eret was just another example -- but not all of them, and if you put too much on the line trying to reach out to those who won't listen then you may not be giving proper protection to the people (and dragons!) under your care. (Also, listen to the advice of the people close to you! Both Stoick and Valka had experience with Drago, but Hiccup rolled his eyes and ignored what they had to say about his stubbornness and desire for war.)

Hiccup's learned now to evaluate the situation more carefully and adjust his actions in accordance. I don't think that contradicts the first film, I think that's building from it. They are all lessons which together make him who he is.
I couldn't have said it any better.
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Coyote-Walker
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Mermaid Viking

micromys
07 Sep 2014, 19:57
I don't think it's a conflicting message, but a combined message, like you said. It's important to have both experiences.

In the first movie, Hiccup gambled a lot on his optimism and it paid off -- it paid off extremely well, so well that he is unwilling to budge from it when faced with a different situation in the second film. That unwillingness ends up coming back to bite him in the end, when his strategy doesn't work and he ends up losing loved ones.

It's a good thing for him to keep in mind as he becomes Chief. He knows minds can be changed -- and they can! Eret was just another example -- but not all of them, and if you put too much on the line trying to reach out to those who won't listen then you may not be giving proper protection to the people (and dragons!) under your care. (Also, listen to the advice of the people close to you! Both Stoick and Valka had experience with Drago, but Hiccup rolled his eyes and ignored what they had to say about his stubbornness and desire for war.)

Hiccup's learned now to evaluate the situation more carefully and adjust his actions in accordance. I don't think that contradicts the first film, I think that's building from it. They are all lessons which together make him who he is.
THIS. <3
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Nightshade
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Monstrous Nightmare

Don't say that something can't kill you, it will end with that thing killing you.
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Pikey
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Wow!

Basically; he jinxed himself. 8)
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