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Unlikable Hiccup moments in ROB/DOB
Topic Started: 26 May 2014, 18:27 (11510 Views)
Crest1347
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Dragon Egg

I do think that that the Heather/Astrid thing and Gustav/Fanghook scenes are unforgivable, but only in their current form. If they had dedicated a few more minutes, it would have been reasonable. After all, Astrid is being extremely hostile to a girl who had (supposedly) gone through a very traumatic experience... because Hiccup spends a bit of time with her? As for Gustav, Hiccup is not saying a flat-out no. He simply saying to a child (remember Gustav is significantly younger than the riders and they are only fifteen or so) that wait for a while. He knows that Fanghook will remember Gustav (remember Torch?). And finally, the riders are up to their necks with Dagur and the Screaming Death. And they have just come off a near-deadly experience with a Skrill. Just a minute or two more and a bit of explaining would have made both of Hiccup's reactions perfect.

Terrible Twos is unforgivable, but a little credit to Hiccup since he only uses the cove as an absolute last resort and he is hurt about leaving Toothless. Maybe amplifying the 'last resort' aspect and his subsequent pain... Maybe.

For me, the least likable moment was in Cast Out, Part I. Snotlout disobeys orders (again), nearly gets Astrid killed, and does not realize what he just did... and all Hiccup does is ground him and (eventually, when the former is disobeyed) locks Hookfang up? He really doesn't seem all that protective of Astrid.

And shame on you, Cami.
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Berserk Shieldmaiden
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Something that kinda erks me was in the episode The Night and The Fury. I know Dagur is an enemy but the way Hiccup acted towards him was in my opinion Un-Hiccupy.

Dagur had come to see Hiccup as a friend and "brother" since he genuinely believes Hiccup saved him from a "dragon attack" on Berk. After finding out it had all been a lie, it was obvious by his reaction that he felt betrayed and even humiliated. Instead of the insult (commenting that Dagur didn't need any help looking like a fool) or threatening to use the dragons against him, maybe Hiccup AND Toothless could've tried extending their friendship to Dagur. Kind of like they did with Astrid (minus the romantic parts of course )

Hiccup managed to end an entire war between Berk and dragons. No doubt he could've helped Dagur come to a new understanding.

I'll probably be told how wrong I am and how Hiccup did the right thing. -_-
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N4raDov
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No, I've actually thought the exact same thing. For me, its the only real unlikeable Hiccup moment in the whole series. Dagur would have made a much more interesting ally than villain, in my opinion. but Hiccup kept ruining any chance of that by alienating Dagur...its like he considered Dagur a villain before he even was one. I think they should have told Dagur the truth from the beginning, and things would have worked out very differently...they may have even been able to train the Skrill together.
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Berserk Shieldmaiden
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N4raDov
29 May 2014, 13:21
No, I've actually thought the exact same thing. For me, its the only real unlikeable Hiccup moment in the whole series. Dagur would have made a much more interesting ally than villain, in my opinion. but Hiccup kept ruining any chance of that by alienating Dagur...its like he considered Dagur a villain before he even was one. I think they should have told Dagur the truth from the beginning, and things would have worked out very differently...they may have even been able to train the Skrill together.
I know right.
Not to mention that Dagur didn't understand dragons the way Berk did. He still saw them as a threat. In Twinsanity, he heard false information (from Alvin no doubt) that Berk was massing an army of dragons. Stoick and Hiccup could've showed him how gentle and non aggressive the dragons really were. That he had nothing to fear. Instead they kept lying. The lying seemed to upset him more than the dragons did.

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N4raDov
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Dovahkiin

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30 May 2014, 01:02
N4raDov
29 May 2014, 13:21
No, I've actually thought the exact same thing. For me, its the only real unlikeable Hiccup moment in the whole series. Dagur would have made a much more interesting ally than villain, in my opinion. but Hiccup kept ruining any chance of that by alienating Dagur...its like he considered Dagur a villain before he even was one. I think they should have told Dagur the truth from the beginning, and things would have worked out very differently...they may have even been able to train the Skrill together.
I know right.
Not to mention that Dagur didn't understand dragons the way Berk did. He still saw them as a threat. In Twinsanity, he heard false information (from Alvin no doubt) that Berk was massing an army of dragons. Stoick and Hiccup could've showed him how gentle and non aggressive the dragons really were. That he had nothing to fear. Instead they kept lying. The lying seemed to upset him more than the dragons did.
Exactly! I see Dagur as a highly misunderstood character. He's crazy and, yea, deranged, but I think they really messed that up. I really think that if they had told him in Twinsanity, then he would have understood and been a great ally. Why the writers thought they needed another villain on top of Alvin and the Screaming Death, I have no idea.
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Norskie
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Throughout the series, Hiccup had this tendency to be a little arrogant and to be a bit of a show-off. Like there was one scene where he was demonstrating a rescue tactic that just completely looked like a trick for a stunt competition. He was pretty zealous because he knew he had the fastest dragon, that sort of irked me a little bit. No way Hiccup would've acted like that in the movie-verse.

However, as Hiccup's role in the show is very unappealing, I very much started to think that Astrid has become my favorite character. She also appears to have some pretty good moments in the upcoming movie.


Uff da, yo.
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N4raDov
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Dovahkiin

I've never thought of Hiccup as arrogant. There's nothing wrong with knowing what you're capable of and utilizing it.
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KentuckyWildcat
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The decision not to tell the truth about the dragons from the outset was pretty questionable. The lie may have been well-intentioned in trying to avoid a war, but was ultimately short-sighted in my opinion. Word of a society that had embraced dragons was bound to get out sooner or later, and once the Beserkers found out they'd been deceived, the relationship between the tribes would be seriously damaged at best and plunged into war at the worst. From both a moral and political standpoint, telling the truth would have been preferable. That was Stoick's idea though, so I can't blame it on Hiccup.

However, despite Berk deserving some blame for lying, I don't think that Hiccup treated Dagur poorly. He tried to be friendly given the circumstances, and Dagur proved to be a violence crazed man who wanted nothing more than to start a war. He killed his own father (or at least hired someone to do it) who he deemed to be too peaceful for goodness sake. He never cared for Hiccup and only considered him a "brother" when he briefly thought him to be a violent dragon killer much like himself. It's understandable to me that Hiccup wouldn't stick around to try and reason with someone who had already definitively proven himself to be unreasonable and was desperately trying to kill Toothless at that very moment.
Come death. Come suffering. I will not live in fear. In this fleeting life where time escapes us, the path of least resistance is a slow quiet death. I'd rather burn out than fade away.
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N4raDov
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KentuckyWildcat
30 May 2014, 04:01
The decision not to tell the truth about the dragons from the outset was pretty questionable. The lie may have been well-intentioned in trying to avoid a war, but was ultimately short-sighted in my opinion. Word of a society that had embraced dragons was bound to get out sooner or later, and once the Beserkers found out they'd been deceived, the relationship between the tribes would be seriously damaged at best and plunged into war at the worst. From both a moral and political standpoint, telling the truth would have been preferable. That was Stoick's idea though, so I can't blame it on Hiccup.

However, despite Berk deserving some blame for lying, I don't think that Hiccup treated Dagur poorly. He tried to be friendly given the circumstances, and Dagur proved to be a violence crazed man who wanted nothing more than to start a war. He killed his own father (or at least hired someone to do it) who he deemed to be too peaceful for goodness sake. He never cared for Hiccup and only considered him a "brother" when he briefly thought him to be a violent dragon killer much like himself. It's understandable to me that Hiccup wouldn't stick around to try and reason with someone who had already definitively proven himself to be unreasonable and was desperately trying to kill Toothless at that very moment.
You brought up some really good points. Makes me look at it a little differently now. But I still think it was possible to avoid Dagur becoming an enemy, and if he'd really wanted to, Hiccup could have done that. That's one of my problems with this being a kids show...sometimes it misses going even deeper and considering things like whether Hiccup could have made the Hooligans and the Berserkers allies for good, instead of just letting things fall apart over one (possibly) unneeded lie. I think they missed a great opportunity to showcase the type of chief Hiccup will be, because he just did what Stoick told him, and it led to war.
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matsuokashina
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Obsessed Dragon Lover

The two episodes where I found Hiccup to be... Not so bearable, I guess, was on Terrible Twos and Heather Report I. Toothless and Astrid were the two that understood him first in HTTYD. Toothless being Hiccup's best friend AND trusty, loyal dragon, and Astrid who is confirmed to be his girlfriend for 5 years. It's like he just shrugged them off and went, "Oh, but these are new people/ dragon, we have to be nice." Was he not suspicious with Heather, at all, in The Heather Report I? I may just be an angry Hiccstrid shipper, but, you know, how are you not suspicious?

Although the series doesn't live up to the movie, it's still enjoyable, and I still love Hiccup to my very core, but him in those two episodes was... Meh... :-/
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