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| [SPOILER] HTTYD 3 Ending Speculations? | |
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| Topic Started: 12 Sep 2014, 14:16 (13044 Views) | |
| Night Fury | 12 Sep 2014, 14:16 Post #41 |
Terrible Terror
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Lol... actually, I'm beginning to think that Valka's death would be the most fitting end to the trilogy. She is the original dragon sympathizer. She basically sets up the entire franchise by giving birth to Hiccup and quietly influencing his personality through her genetic code. Fast forward to HTTYD 2 when she kidnaps Hiccup which sets up another chain of events, ultimately resulting in Stoick's death. Valka and Stoick respresent a sort of yin and yang... two divergent aspects of Hiccup's identity that work in tandem to maintain balance. The void left by Stoick's death has created an imbalance in these forces, so Valka needs to die in order to restore that balance. |
| Cartoon Freak | 12 Sep 2014, 21:03 Post #42 |
Deadly Nadder
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Then, to put it simply, he doesn't know his own movie, at least for the first one, because again, that could not be a more textbook case of "A boy and his x". I would ideally like to watch the second film a few more times before making a definitive statement on it, but honestly, given that Stoick's relevance to the plot practically vanishes after the funeral (as opposed to something like The Lion King, where Mufasa's remains relevant throughout the climax), whereas Toothless remains relevant, I'll stand by my statement for the moment. This sort of thing is, for better or for worse, not uncommon in fiction. Writers will set out to do one thing, and unconsciously do the other. Edward Cullen is supposed to be a romantic ideal. Rayford Steele and Buck Williams are supposed to be heroic. Valka is supposed to be heroic. And now apparently HTTYD is supposed to be a father-son story, rather than the "A boy and his dragon story" that it could not more obviously be. I suppose that the last one is proof that it need not always be a bad thing. Of course, we're also dodging a rather important point: Stoick is dead, and we have one movie left to go. One way or another, it's not going to be feasible to make the Hiccup/Stoick relationship the focus of the third movie. Therefore, we are left with a simple question: how do we get a conclusive ending? The logical answer is to, in some way, separate Hiccup and Toothless. You're dodging the fundamental issue here, so I'm going to just cut right to the chase: how do you create a more definitive ending to HTTYD 3 than the one that already exists for the original film? Because in the end, if you can't do that, then the sequels are ultimately pointless. And it's not an easy thing to do, either: the original HTTYD resolved all of its issues. In other words, it already created a situation where there didn't need to be any more sequels, so in order for there to be a more definitive ending, HTTYD 3 needs to create a situation where there can't be any more sequels. This pretty much requires that they separate Hiccup and Toothless, at the very least. You have suggested one other possibility that could work from that perspective, that is, having Hiccup leave with the dragons. However, that would render a large part of HTTYD 2 pointless, since Hiccup would be running away from his responsibilities as chief. It's highly unlikely that that ending would work, but it would be a more definitive ending than the one for the original film. |
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Number of times I've watched the trailer: 18. My pet peeve: people who refer to complete strangers by their first name. The correct ways to refer to a "John Smith" whom you have never met are Smith, Mr Smith, or John Smith. Not "John". He's not your buddy. | |
| Night Fury | 12 Sep 2014, 21:50 Post #43 |
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Terrible Terror
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Well, the obvious answer is that it's both... a father/son story and a "boy and his x" story, but I think the filmmakers intended the father/son dynamic to be the larger overarching theme. You have a point, though, because the majority of fans prefer to focus on the Hiccup/Toothless element. Hell, I prefer it myself. HTTYD 2 is sort of all over the place. The first hour is actually pretty light on substance between Toothless and Hiccup. Before the battle of Alphas, Toothless has about as much relevance to the plot as Cloudjumper does. Sure, we get the requisite friendship scenes and cute stuff, but his main function in the actual plot is to act as a bridge between Hiccup and Valka. Stoick has way more going on plot-wise, at least in the first two acts. It's not until we meet Drago that Toothless begins to take an active role in the proceedings, and then it's pretty much 100% Hicctooth after Stoick's funeral. Yeah, I know. The main point I was trying to make is that Hiccup and Toothless isn't the only story the films are telling. I guess I'm not as obsessed with the idea of a perfectly conclusive ending as you are. In fact, I wouldn't have minded if the ending of HTTYD 2 had been the ending for the trilogy. I don't really need to know what happens after Hiccup and Toothless become leaders. It feels like the end of a chapter without being needlessly final. Based on interviews I read when the sequel was first announced, I think the original plan was to end the trilogy with Hiccup becoming chief. This was back when Valka was still going to be the antagonist of the second film. I'm pretty sure the idea for having the dragons disappear only came about when Dean realized that he had to change his plans for the second film and bring Drago in early, which left a huge void in the third film that he had to fill with another idea. |
| MartianArchaeologist | 12 Sep 2014, 22:14 Post #44 |
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Gronckle
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Have been thinking about this today. I'll clarify a few things, then I'll make my official guess (or what I would like to see happen) I think the theme for the overarching story might be "Understanding". Hiccup spends much of HTTYD trying to understand this mysterious dragon, then trying to get Berk to understand. But at the end of HTTYD, Hiccup doesn't completely understand Toothless. And Toothless has just gotten to know humans. Neither of them understands how to be chief. And as HTTYD2 shows, neither of them completely understands himself. One of the reviewers for HTTYD2 said that Hiccup spent much of that movie discovering things. In HTTYD2, I was struck by Hiccup's victory cry. Not "Eat plasma, you one-armed freak!" but "NOW DO YOU GET IT?" Hiccup discovers that Toothless is King Dragon material, Toothless has discovered more about chiefieness from both Stoick and Hiccup. And the Bewilderbeast. In the "Big Baby-Boo" scene, Toothless is trying to make Hiccup understand something; even batting Hiccup on the head and threatening to drop him off a cliff. Hiccup still refuses to get it because he flicks dragon-spit back at Toothless. If HTTYD3 is about Parenthood, say, then we get more understanding. For example, I don't think Valka knows how to be a mother. The reason is because she was looking at the baby dragons haranguing both the Bewilderbeast and Toothless and saying "Except the babies, who listen to no one." First time I saw the babies, I thought "Hey kids, where's your mom?" I thought they had been orphaned and were running around going "Are you my mom? Nope! So you're not the boss of me!" (Yes, my kids have done this.) Stoick knew how to be a parent. I think Gobber's the best mom on Berk, and maybe he can show her about humans by using dragons as an example. This is speculation, but it shows why HTTYD is not the end-all of the story. Of course Stoick can be in Movie 3. Hiccup really doesn't understand his dad from a parent's point of view. The standard "Wait till you have kids of your own" really and truly does apply. But Hiccup is partway to understanding about being a parent, just from the way he went about learning about Toothless. So if the theme is "understanding"-- In Toy Story 3, that one last scene where Andy was describing each of his toys, and getting their personalities exactly--especially Woody--that one moment, you felt they were connected. Then they both move on. It could be played that way. However, it could also be played this way: At the end of HTTYD3, there is one thing that Hiccup doesn't understand about Toothless--something that has been invisible--just like a Night Fury--until he realizes it. In both the first and second movie, you couldn't find the nests unless a dragon led you there. Except for that very first time....which would make this structure chiastic. In the third movie, Toothless could take the dragons and hide somewhere no human could find, unless a dragon led the human there. You can't get there unless you understand. When Hiccup realizes what that final piece of understanding is, then he can go there. It could even be years later, after the "There used to be dragons" scene, when he's teaching his son something, and then realizes it. (Maybe even after the ending credits.)
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| MartianArchaeologist | 12 Sep 2014, 22:16 Post #45 |
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Gronckle
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Also disagree about HTTYD2 being "all over the place". Everything about the two movies is very, very tight. You just have to know where the structure is. |
| Night Fury | 12 Sep 2014, 23:21 Post #46 |
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Terrible Terror
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Maybe a little too tight... it jumps from scene to scene very quickly without allowing much time for the meaning to sink in. The first film was better in that regard because it had a more tightly-focused story. It's quite obvious they ran into time constraints in the second, and Dean has acknowledged that much. I would love to see an extended edition one day, even if some parts of it were only storyboarded. |
| Berkian1 | 13 Sep 2014, 00:23 Post #47 |
Terrible Terror
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This may be just me but if they do decide to tell about the disappearance of the dragons, I want the ending to be Hiccup telling us about his hopes of the dragons' return one day. Maybe something like, "Yes there were dragons when I was a boy, and maybe, just maybe they will one day return" or something like that. Then Maybe they could show a modern day Berk and we hear the scream of a night fury and that's it. I just like the idea of the story having a little bit of hope at the end without making it too sappy. |
| "Hiccup what you're looking for isn't out there. It's in here, maybe you just don't see it yet." | |
| WasBornCrazy | 13 Sep 2014, 03:44 Post #48 |
i dont think my avatar is working but ehh
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Some have stated this already, but the whole series is based on the fact that success comes with a sacrifice. i.e HTTYD=foot HTTYD 2=Stoick So, HTTYD 3=dragons? Yes, but a scream of a night fury and a modern day setting doesn't exactly 'fit' the series. HTTYD has been different because of its age. The designers could be imaginative, they could make rock formations, or strange building and objects, because not much is known about the Viking times (not that much). If a modern age setting comes in, it changes quite some things. A echoing (and slowly fading) dragon roar would be nice though. |
| i'm not very active anymore!! it's sad, but i'll come back sometimes to feel nostalgic ahaha | |
| DarthBacon | 13 Sep 2014, 05:11 Post #49 |
Gronckle
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Here's how I guess the 3rd movie might play out... 1. Drago returns. He is going to be the major plot throughout the whole movie. He's going to be all If I can't have any dragons then no one can kinda mood, and he is out for blood. 2. Nightfuries. One, or two or how many i don't know. But for sure, Nightfuries are going to come in. And Drago is going to be the reason behind it. Drago's fireproof cloak looked sickeningly similar to Toothless's skin, and it MIGHT be a fully grown Nightfury's skin. 3. Hiccup and Toothless are going to disagree on a lot of things. I think the conflict between them, started off by what happened in HTTYD2, is not fully resolved yet. My bet is that they both find another Nightfury, and Toothless won't trust it, but Hiccup is adamant and ends up in the hands( or in the hand  ) of Drago. 4. All of this comes together in a scenario in which a dragon is killed by Toothless, or a human is killed by a dragon, or a dragon is killed by a human. Then Hiccup realises that dragons and humans cannot live without the fear that such things might happen again, and they have to separate. |
  
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| Pikey | 13 Sep 2014, 09:18 Post #50 |
Wow!
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I don't see why they absolutely have to be separated, and to me, reasoning it with 'because that's the only way it could happen/be killed of with' doesn't seem to fulfill anything. That's essentially saying that the plot ending should be predictable years before the movie is even released, and that's perfectly alright. I would hope that if they did end up going down that route, that it isn't just one event that causes it, especially not 'oh no someone died now the dragons must be gone'. Besides, I also have a problem with the fact that it seems to be mostly humans creating this problem with the peace, and dragons having to be sent away into hiding for it? Seems just a bit on the unfair side to me... |
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